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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1976-08-30 Committee of the Whole MinutesAugust 30, 1976 7:30 P.M. CALL TO ORDER ROLL CALL OF COUNCIL MEMBERS DISCUSSION Fire Dept. proposal on Social Security MINUTES GARDNER, MS. PESICKA, VAN DUSEN, MS. HARRIS. CITY OF TUKWILA Tukwila City Hall COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE MEETING Council Chambers MOVED BY HARRIS, SECONDED BY MS. PESICKA, THAT COUNCILMAN VAN DUSEN ACT AS CHAIRMAN OF THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE MEETING IN THE ABSENCE OF COUNCILMAN HILL. CARRIED. Chairman Van Dusen called the Committee of the Whole Meeting to order at 7:42 P.M. Sam Ruljanich, Fire Fighter, and Councilman Harris said they had been in contact with the Fire Chief of Fire District No. 1 and the men in that Fire District are satisfied with the plan they have chosen since withdrawing from Social Security. He said the situation in Fire District No. 25 is different, some of the people are already on Social Security whereas in Fire District No. 1 they are not. Js.Pesicka asked if Councilman Harris or Mr. Ruljanich had talked to anyone who had been on an alternate plan for several years. Councilman Harris said they had not as the whole program is rather new. Councilman Harris said in seeking information she had contacted a man from Mercer Island, formerly with New York Life and now an independent agent. He is setting up alternate plans with other municipalities and private corporations. She said they had talked about the cost and the suggestion was that an actuarial survey be done on the individual so they can formulate their advice on what it would mean looking into the future. She said the rate the City would contribute to such a program is unknown, whether it would be dollar for dollar or what is not known. Mr. Ruljanich said the actuarial report has been done by Bellevue, Kirkland, Mountlake Terrace, etc. and each person's case is different. He said this does not affect the amount paid by the individual or by the City, just the benefits they would receive. In most of the cities the cost of the actuarial report has been borne by the City. Chairman Van Dusen said he understood the firemen, were waiting to vote on withdrawal from Social Security until such a time as they would know to what extent the City would participate in a similar program. Mr. Ruljanich said they would not vote until they had this information, they were not trying to add any cost to the City. Chairman Van Dusen said he would like this matter to be in the negotiations. Mr. Ruljanich said the Fire Fighters did not feel this should be tied to negotiation, it is not related to that. Councilman Harris said House Bill 252 passed the Legislature authorizing a municipality to deduct an amount to be used for similar purposes as Social Security. She said an individual can put in a set amount from his pay check each month then the City would match the amount. The City could put a lid on the amount of money they would match. In some cases there is an "open" month once a year when the individual can add to or make smaller the amount deducted from his paycheck. She said the firemen are not asking the amount contributed by the City to be given to them directly. She said she asked Mr. Hard for a legal opinion as to whether or not the City has a right to say they would not participate in another plan if the firemen say they do not want to participate in Social Security. His legal opinion is that payments made by the City are a form of compensation which the City must continue, they are a form of annuity, it is part of their salary. Chairman Van Dusen said the lid could be the amount that would be paid to Social Security if the firemen had remained in that program, then the individual could put in what he wanted to as his own contribution. Sam Ruljanich said the deferred plan would let a fireman put in up to 100% of his pay check if he wished. He said he was also interested in asking the City Attorney if the city is obliged to contribute as much as Social Security would be. Mayor Bauch said it was his understanding that if the individual does not wish to participate then the City would not have to put in any amount for that individual in another pension plan. Mr. Ruljanich said the firemen did not have a pension proposal in mind to ask the City to participate in. Councilman Harris said the City Attorney had written a letter to the City Council that reflects his legal opinion on the matter, if the firemen decide to withdraw CITY OF TUKWILA COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE MEETING August 30, 1976 Page 2 DISCUSSION Contd. Fire Dept. proposal from Social Security. Mayor Bauch recommended that the letter on Social Security from the City Attorney be reviewed by the City Council and then the Contd. matter be on the agenda for the City Council Regular Meeting to be held September 7. The City Attorney will be present at the meeting and can answer any questions that may be asked. Sam Ruljanich said he would like to have the City Attorney express his opinion on the matter. He added the deferred pension plan had been the most acceptable to the firemen; Councilman Pesicka said when she called the City of Santa Maria to ask about their experience with the deferred plan she was told the medical liability was not sufficient and they had to take out additional medical coverage for the men. Mayor Bauch said this is something the firemen will have to think about as they will be voting for future firemen. Future firemen will be kept from receiving Social Security as once there is a withdrawal from Social Security you cannot get back on. Councilman Harris said the Fire Department has the ultimate decision in their hands, there is a motion to consider at the next City Council meeting and she would like to have some type of alternate motion to consider. Mayor Bauch said he felt it is an economic issue that should be determined at the bargaining table. Sam Ruljanich said the firemen are not asking for any more money than the City has been paying for Social Security. Chairman Van Dusen said he thought the best thing would be to get a legal opinion from the City Attorney. Mr. Ruljanich said he had information from other areas outlining the alternate plans they are using. He expressed the opinion that the plan being used by the City of Bellevue is not what the firemen want and it does not relate to their best interests. He said if they decide to withdraw from Social Security it will be because they have found something better and at the most it will cost the City the same amount. Councilwoman Pesicka said there will be increased cost to the City in bookkeeping, etc. Councilman Harris said the City Council needs to talk about a definite figure that the City will have to contribute. We might say we are going to contribute to the amount the Social Security contribution would be; if Social Security increases we could say we would not contribute more. It could be tied at the 5.8% figure. She continued the City Council has to formulate the degree of participation, then an ordinance can be drawn up. Chairman Van Dusen said the City Council would probably rather the firemen continue on Social Security, but it is not their decision to make. Councilman Harris said it is the amount of money the City would have to contribute that is of prime consideration. ADJOURNMENT 9:30 P.M. MOVED BY MS. PESICKA, SECONDED BY GARDNER, THAT THE SOCIAL SECURITY DISCUSSION BE ON THE AGENDA FOR THE CITY COUNCIL REGULAR MEETING TO BE HELD SEPTEMBER 7, 1976. CARRIED. Discussion continued with Councilman Harris saying the firemen can vote as to whether or not they want to go ahead with Social Security or withdraw from it. Mayor Bauch said he thought the City should have the selection of what alternate plan the firemen accept if they withdraw from Social Security. The alternate plan would have to be a contract between the City and the insurance company. Mr. Ruljanich said it was his concern to get the vote taken as the fire- men are not covered by Social Security at present nor by any other plan. MOVED BY MS. PESICKA, SECONDED BY GARDNER, THAT THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE MEETING ADJOURN. CARRIED. Norm'- Booher, Recording Secretary